Sydney VS Melbourne

So I thought I would start thread considering so many of my overseas friends ask me the quesiton:

"Which is better...Sydney or Melbourne?"

Well i am a bit bias because I grew up in Melbourne, but I think Sydney has it's good points as well.

I think most people will say Sydney is much more business orientated and has a much faster lifestyle. It also has a high fashion social scene, and some people say the people are ruder? I don't think so, but you be the judge.

Melbourne on the other hand is a bit sleepier and has a much more subtle social scene. Most people will agree that Melbourne has the ability to show you something amazing down every little alleyway, whether it be a cool chic bar or a grungy pub.

Many people have drawn comparisons between the New York/LA argument saying Sydney is like the later because of it's superficial nature.

What do you think?
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Mindtrap 2yrs+
Weather (have been to both cities in every season...): Sydney wins 50-nil
Food: Both have excellent restaurants and equally pricey
Beaches: Need I say it? Sydney wins 50-nil
Harbour: Sydney wins: 100-nil. Melbourne tried to copy Sydney with the Docklands...it failed. It is boring, the shops open and close all the time.
Historical architecture: Melbourne wins 50-30.
Shopping: They most beautiful shopping centre is the Block Arcade and it can be compared to Sydney's The Strand Arcade. Sydney opened a Westfield in Pitt St Mall which is superb. Both cities have everything for everybody. It's a draw.
Affordability: Melbourne prices are almost the same as Sydney...the thing is they don't have the amazing harbour Sydney has and that's why people have the idea that prices in Sydney are dearer. Many years ago perhaps Melbourne was cheaper in general....but now? Not even Darwin...
Safety: Funnily enough, Sydney is safer than Melbourne....have a look at the statistics. Also there are a lot of beggars in Melbourne city, something that should be dealt with.
16 votes
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Jason Spencer
Jason Spencer Agree with most except beggars. Around the Pitt St Mall much more than Melbourne. Then again both have nothing on cities like San Francisco where you will often see groups of 20 people in a row.
2yrs+
MichaelF
MichaelF Hey Sydney has a very boring and unhip CBD.....too much tired Art Deco architecture and daggy 80s style cafés...melbourne has chic grungy alleys enclosed by glorious tree lined streets with 1880s boom time architecture...our restaurants like chin chin and movida are amazing and affordable, while Sydney can only do boring high end food well. I love both cities, but get real if you think dining in a caf, being surrounded by VIP lounge pokie joints is hip...
2yrs+
kayl2
kayl2 Superficial? I what's superficial about the most beautiful natural harbour in the world, gorgeous beaches and national parks?
We will always be the biggest and the best. Who cares what Melborings with their upside river think.
2yrs+
Stuart Mitchell
Stuart Mitchell Wow i'm guessing that this was written buy a person from Sydney....Let look at affordablity Sydney median house price is well over $1,000,000, Melbourne its around the mid $600's. Nightlife, Sports, Arts Cafes and restaurants Melbourne has no equal and with lock out laws Sydney is a DEAD city at night. Don't get me wrong Sydneys Harbour and beaches are beautiful and Melbourne cannot compete but once you head out of that there are allot of problems for Sydney. For the last 5 years Melbourne has been rated the "Most liveable city" in the world beating out some amazing city's.
2yrs+
kyles2
kyles2 Mindtrap, please tell me where in terms of statistics that Sydney is safer than Melbourne? Mind you , I have been told by outside sources that the rental prices of Sydney have LOWERED now as people want to sell rooms and keep people coming into it; perhaps even lower than Melbourne is right now...
2yrs+
thomass8
thomass8 All I have to say is Sydney is way better than Melbourne, and truth is I'm from the old crapy place.
2yrs+
janb2
janb2 I lived in Sydney 35 yrs till just recently then moved to Melbourne. My comments as I see them: (and Im going to be brutally honest);
Sydney,
slick, business-minded, great street scapes - home owners take pride in gardens, great clean beaches, tougher on crime, a tad clinical looking, felt safer in the mid to high end suburbs. Less ethnic crime. High house prices. More organised. Best harbour in the world.
Melbourne,
Nanny state, lazy or soft on crime - whilst police doing their best, their efforts are often frustrated by lack of power, filthy grungy street scapes ie no distinction between good safe suburbs to low end so you never know (if new in the place) where is safe. Far too many home invasions, too many drive by shootings. OMG its out of control! Pollen storms causing deaths. I wrote to the Premiers office to ask if they can replace flowering kerb side natives and MOW the vast grass lands and KERBS to prevent asthma - sent in photos for proof but no response. Graffiti everywhere, councils seem to be a bit slack. I noticed that the white lines on the road need repainting for drivers, most are faded so dangerous for interstate and tourist drivers. With all the tram crossings it may be confusing on the roads. I will say though the little alleys in and around the CBD are filled with character and fine food and great fashion. Beaches in Melb, are ok, views from Arthur's seat SPECTACULAR. For me though, Sydney rules as safer - my most important factor when raising a family so needless to say we are all moving back to Sydney.
2yrs+
janb2
janb2 You asked for stats on crime: On the news tonight (Melb) disclosed that home invasions up 25000 or so from last yr. I think it said up from around 225000 plus per year! In my view Melbourne is a very dangerous state not helped by the Premiers lack of priority to sort it out. When you have bikie gangs going to protest in Sunshine to plead with the Premier to sort out the crime stemming from the state's drug problem, you know you have a problem! Do you get it now?
2yrs+
oceank
oceank Why do you all hate Melbourne so much, both are great cities, but someone from Melbourne wouldn't call sydney people 'boring'. Ultimately, that's what makes Melbourne better, we're nice. We're laid back, fashion forward, cultured, classy, and nice.
Feb 23, 2019
billj5
billj5 I disagree with the facts which were discussed about Melbourne.
Jul 16, 2019
anneb35
anneb35 Im was born in Sydney and moved to Melbourne in my 40 s . I lived in the Shire and grew up on the southern beaches . A lovely part of the world Two of my kids were high school age and the youngest was in primary school. And were taken kicking and screaming to Melbourne . I say Melbourne wins hands down in comparison to Sydney.. Great city , usable with so much going on . Amazing precincts - sport , art, Southbank, shopping. Great live music, cafes, walks, parks. Life is slower and children grow up slower . Amazing network of cycling paths and wetland walks in every suburb. My famiky love Melbourne and would never move back Sydney . We lnever went into the city in Sydney but now spend loads of time happily wandering around the city here. The traffic is better ( although it is getting worse) will concede that Sydney beaches kill Melbournes but the Mornington Peninsula and the towns and beaches along the Great Ocean Road are gorgeous. I hate winter here but spring summer and autumn are lovely and way less humid than Sydney . Melbourne every day iof the week for me .
Sep 25, 2019
marcw
marcw I'm European, lived in London, Cambridge, Milan, Brussels and Nice.
Beauty/Climate: Sydney is prettier. The harbour, the rocks, the Opera House. Melbourne is greyer, but the Royal Botanic Gardens, Carlton Gardens and Birrarung Marr are wonderful. Port Phillip Bay isn't as pretty as the Sydney Harbour, but Brighton Beach and the baby penguins in St. Kilda are cute. Sydney is stunning, its weather is sunnier and more pleasant than Melbourne's. That being said, don't act like the Grampians, the Dandenong, the Great Ocean Road (!) or Phillip Island, Venus Bay and the Yarra Valley and its wineries weren't awesome. If you think Melbourne is ugly, you're lying to yourself.

Infrastructure/Growth: Melbourne's CBD is bigger, the city is growing at a faster pace, there's a lot of innovation going on. Melbourne's trams are nice and so is its train network. Buses are a bit better in Sydney (which is improving its transport network), but its streets are a maze. The airport in Sydney cannot be compared to Melbourne's: no curfews on the latter. Melbourne is cleaner, the streets are wider.

Cultural scene: well... Melbourne wins this round.
- No lockout laws in Melbourne, unlike Sydney.
- Food in Melbourne is better, and so is coffee. There's just a higher number of eateries in Melbourne. The food scene is in the city's DNA.
- Melbourne has the highest number of commercial art galleries in the world. It also has the oldest and largest bookshop in Australasia (The Foreign Language Bookshop). Melbourne dwarfs Sydney when it comes to Cinema, Visual Arts and Fashion, too. Melbourne is the birthplace of the Hemsworth brothers and Kylie Minogue.
- The largest movie screen in the world is in Melbourne now, even though Sydney's one is still huge.
- Events held in Melbourne are amazing - so are those in Sydney... But Melbourne's Fashion Week makes more sense to me since the weather allows you to wear a leather jacket or a coat without looking like a weirdo. Both cities have impressive feats of festivals all year round.
- Melbourne is less tourist-oriented than Sydney, which is a good thing - it feels more authentic.
- Shopping malls: although I love Westfield Sydney (+ the Tower Eye) and the Queen Victoria Building, Melbourne offers the largest shopping mall in the Southern Hemisphere. The city centre is full of shops, many of which are in historic arcades and laneways.
- Unlike Sydney, Melbourne retained much of its XIXth century theatres. The Opera House of Sydney is amazing, but so is Princess Theatre (even though I prefer the former). Melbourne has the largest amount of theatres and performance venues in Australia, though. Melbourne is the home of the Australian Ballet Company. Melbourne is recognised as a leading hub for comedy in the world.
- The sports scene is better in Melbourne. The MCG / Birrarung Marr area... enough said. Both cities hosted the Olympics anyway.
- The State Library of Victoria was founded before that of New South Wales, although the latter seems to have a larger catalogue than the former. Melbourne was recognised as a City of Literature by the UNESCO, though.
- Queer culture is big in both cities, but the 2017 vote on marriage equality showed Melbourne and Victoria are more open-minded (and Midsumma Festival lasts much longer than Sydney's Mardi Gras).
- Melbourne hosts the HQ of the most popular newspaper in Australia (The Herald Sun). Sydney is the media capital of Australia, though, and the Daily Telegraph is headquartered there.
- Melbourne University ranks #1 in Australia (and #32 in the world).

Bonus: Melbourne's Skyline > Sydney's skyline. Melbourne is the fastest-growing city in the Western World.
Apr 03, 2020
Krishiv K
Krishiv K Did anyone even bother reading marcw's post?
LOL
If you did. Man you need something better to do
May 04, 2020
jordenw
jordenw Sydney is better because Sydney has a tower buffet which is so cool and has iconic attractions like SYDNEY OPERA HOUSE and SYDNEY HARBOUR BRIDGE. But Melbourne is more liveable but doesn't matter. I rate Sydney 10 of 10 Melbourne 8 of 10
May 28, 2020
alea
alea Krishiv K yeah I read marcw's post, it was insightful. It was also true. Melbourne is way better than Sydney
Jun 06, 2020
Happy Bunni Hihihi
Happy Bunni Hihihi I think Melbourne is Wayyyyy Better For Togoraphy And Tree Cover And Is Good For Nightlife. Even though it has not very good public transport, I Live In Melbourne And Ive Visited Sydney. There Are ABSOLUTELY NO TRAMS There. Both cities landmarks Are Great. Melbourne Also Is Way Cheaper Than Sydney Depending On Most Neighbourhoods. Sydneys Median House Price is 1MIL but Melbourne is only 850K(on avg) Melbourne Does Better On Culture But The Beaches On Sydney Are Great. The Weather Is Slightly Better There(because half of the time in Melbourne it rains/cloudy) Sydney Has more mild Weather. Overall I fell Both Of them are the same (But I think Melbourne is slightly better for crime rate) Melbourne does have tourist ferry as well. Even though Sydney has A beautiful Harbor but Melbourne still has things that Sydney does.(even tho I havent talked about most of it but I would say Melbourne is The Same.) And Pls if you hate Melbourne pls read this and all cities are made equal. Even though one has great beaches and a Harbour, Melbourne does have a ferry, great beaches and a bay. Overall they would be the same and Im not lying
Disclaimer: this is from my personal experiences
Jul 05, 2020
chooc
chooc In Respond to Marcw:
-INFRASTRUCTURE/GROWTH:

Melbourne a decade behind when it comes to new infrastructure: The judgement of two prominent Melbournians, including Federal Minister for Cities, Urban Infrastructure and Population, MP Alan Tudge.
Sydney is currently experiencing $100Bil expenditure in the next four years for infrastructure, as well as 74 NSW fast-track projects that being held in the last few years & $137Billon in stimulus measures (compares to $8.9B in VIC). There are three NSW fast-tracks tranche projects will be operational in the next 6 months. The biggest projects in term of dollar value and volume in Australia.
Under the new Greater Sydney Commisionm, Sydney is now divided into 3 cities:
First City, Sydney City of Eastern Harbour which includes conventional Sydney CBD and the surroundings, North Sydney CBD, Chatswood, Macquarie Park, Crow Nest & St Leonard. The second City is the City of River Parramatta. And third City, the City of Parkland Badgerys Creek Aerotropolis. Standalone, Badgerys Creek Aerotropolis has designated 112 km2 of land which is about 37 times larger than conventional Sydney CBD. Badgerys Creek will be home to Sydney second 24/7 international airport, Western Sydney Airport (WSA) with a budget of $5.3B and there will have a Metro South North to be operational in day one when the Western Sydney Airport is fully operational in 2026 with capacity of 80 million passengers once it is fully expansion in the further future.
Sydney has 3 fully operational trams (light rail) and it is one of the longest trams in the world for L2 & L3 lines. One of the feature of these trams is wireless from Circular Quay to Town Hall so you dont have the wires overheads in the Sydney CBD. River City of Parramatta is currently constructing the forth L4 Light Rail with potential expanding to Olympics Park (L5).
Sydney is definitely has the best public transport system in Australia with the Australia first driverless Metro operational last June 2019. This Australia first Metro System is expanding from Chatswood to Bankstown, from Sydney CBD to Westmead via Parramatta, WSA to St Mary and future projects are expansion from Westmead to WSA and more.
Judging by your notes, you definitely have not been to Sydney or updated the latest information. Sydney is actually cleaner and well organised than Melbourne. The narrow and organically streets are actually given Sydney an edge. City of Sydney Council has planned and built dozens of amazing laneways in the last 10 years. Sydney has won so many international & world awards for park, garden and architecture. The latest add on the lists were:
-Green space in Sydneys Central park wins top international award by 2020 Green Good Design Award for Green urban Planning/landscape Architecture.
-Sydney Fish Market is overall winner of The Plan Award for best future project.
-505 George Street development wins international architecture award.

Sydney is the global city that invented the World Earth Day. It is now practised by more than 100 countries worldwide.

Sydney is now first city in Australia to join C40 Cities and as of yesterday, the City of Sydney is powered by 100% renewable electricity. Thats what real climate action looks like. It is a benchmark for all Australian cities to follow suite.

CULTURAL SCENE:
- The days of mocking Sydneys nightlife are over.
The Joint Select Committee on Sydneys Night Time Economy had set to hand down a report to the NSW Parliament last November. Night Time Economy has been proposed to further expand to all Metropolitan of Sydney.
- I think Sydney food and bar screens are as good as Melbourne if not better.
Gourmet Traveller has release its list of the top 50 restaurants in Australia for 2020. Sydney dominates the field with 21 entries, followed by Melbourne (a distant second with 11). I think it is the Citys DNA as well.
-The Worlds Top 50 Bars have been announced in Landon, joining the outer list (51-100) that was announced. Sydney is home to impressive four of the five Australian bars on the list (43, 66, 79 & 95) with Maybe Sammy, Sydney the best of 43 positions held in Australia (reference 7).
-An article by Melbourne author describe, how Melbourne has dropped the ball. Melbourne likes to think of itself as Australias foodie capital, but theres a key reason why Sydney has taken its crown (reference 6).

-Sydney is really on the right track to improve its liveable city ranking in term of cultural. There are substantial cultural & sporting projects going to be completed in the next few years:-
~ Sydney Modern
~ Australian Museum (Egyptian Tutankhamen exhibition). It may postpone due to COVID-19.
~ Opera House Refurbishment
~ Welsh Bay Art Precinct
~ Royal Lyric Theatre
~ Central Barangaroo Lyrics Theatre (future proposal)
~ Western Sydney Lyric Theatre
~ Ultimo Power House Museums Lyrics Theatre
~ Parramatta Power House Museum
~ Sydney Zoo
~ Parramatta Riverside Theatre
~ Sydney new Fish Market
~ Moore Park Football Stadium
~ Olympics Park Football Stadium
~ Parramatta Football Stadium
~ World ATP Cup
~ HSBC Sydney Sevens
~ Phoenix Art Gallery
~ Carriageworks extension
~ Ultimo Design & Fashion Museum (it is now the core powerhouse museum)
~ Marrickville Creative Hub (creative art capital of Australia)

-Largest shopping mall is actually not a very inviting according to Monocle World most liveable city ranking. Albeit Chris Hemsworth is born in Melbourne, Chris has chosen to settle in Byron Bay, NSW and Kylie Minogue in London.
-More tourists in Sydney is because of Sydney is beautiful.
-Both cities hosted the Olympics Games, but the best Olympics Games was actually in Sydney.
-Sydney has more UNESCO heritage sites than Melbourne.

-World famous Broadway shows Hamilton & Frozen are coming to Sydney.
-FIFA Women Cup 2022 will be final at Sydney ANZ Stadium. There are possibilities that AFL will be played at Sydney due to COVID-19. Organisers in Sydney is determined to bring world event on the monthly basis to Sydney rival Melbourne as the Sport Capital of Australia.

-The QS World University Rankings 2020 have been released. Sydney is the only Australian city with two universities in the top 50 (University of Sydney is second in Australia and No. 40 in the world, University of NSW is forth in Australia and no. 44 in the world). Melbourne University is No. 31 behind University of Sydney.

-Melbourne may runs a longer Midsumma Festival but Mardi Gras Festival is the world event. And the mother of all cultural event, World Pride 2023 is coming to Sydney with an expected 1 million attendees. It will be the first time held in Asia & Southern Hemisphere.

References:
1. https://www.news.com.au/finance/business/travel/melbourne-a-decade-behind-when-it-comes-to-new-infrastructure/news-story/0fd960efb5e2a10b9b1009c88b8454b0
2. https://www.domain.com.au/news/green-space-in-sydneys-central-park-wins-top-international-award-959284/#:~:text=Green%20space%20in%20Sydney's%20Central%20Park%20wins%20top%20international%20award,-Sue%20WilliamsDomain&text=A%20communal%20green%20space%20in,which%20to%20replenish%20the%20spirit%E2%80%9D.
3. https://3xn.com/news/sydney-fish-market-overall-winner-plan-award-best-future-project
4. https://www.buildaustralia.com.au/projects/505-george-street-wins-international-architectural-review-mipim-future-project-award/#:~:text=The%20Architectus%20and%20Ingenhoven%20Architects,property%20exhibition%20in%20Cannes%2C%20France.
5. https://www.gourmettraveller.com.au/dining-out/restaurant-guide/top-50-restaurants-australia-2020-17590
6. https://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-ideas/food-drink/how-melbourne-has-dropped-the-ball/news-story/e30425f8eb321407327553a7733c318d
7. https://www.worlds50bestbars.com/
Jul 05, 2020
Nicholas Stoult
Nicholas Stoult Melbourne is filthy, freezing, grey and has no train from the airport, oh and it has no decent beaches. They do events very well, and by Australian standards culture, but compared to Sydney's beaches and beaches it looks dirty and ugly.
Jul 09, 2020
pingio
pingio Also Sydney Has Botany Bay Sorry About My Last Rewiew
Jul 19, 2020
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mickey20 2yrs+
IMHO, Melbourne is far more liveable. Sydney is where I advise foreign friends to visit if they only have time for one city. On a nice day Sydney is one of the most gorgeous cities in the world.

But Melbourne is much more interesting to live after the novelty of Harbour Bridge etc. wears off.

Aside from all the sports, Melbourne has lots of cultural activities, a crazy amount of good food to eat (a lot of it surprisingly affordable) and is easier to get around. But the biggest difference is the people. For a city its size, I find Melbourne to be very friendly and people quite helpful. Don't get me wrong, Sydney is tourist friendly but is a little too boastful. Melbourne is more understated, but also more genuine.

I'd equate living in either city to dating back in college. Sydney's like the hot girl who wears designer clothing, likes fine dining on the harbour, doesn't have too try hard to get dates because she's so attractive, and is also a little vacuous and superficial. Melbourne is like the cute artsy girl who is smarter, way more interesting, and a nicer person. One will bankrupt you while the other will show you the cheap dumpling place for dinner and where to get good craft beer.

Live in Melbourne, visit Sydney.
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HarryKumarH
HarryKumarH Very well said
I was in Sydney for 8 years and still call myself a Sydneysider but now in Melbourne from last 3 years however Melbourne much livable.I call Sydney is like my girlfriend and Melbourne is like my wife.
2yrs+
nk1
nk1 I think it depends on the person. With a tourist mindset, I'd say Melbourne is really interesting while Sydney is a bit eh (although I've never gone around Sydney as a tourist). I love the free tram zone especially. But I'd have to disagree with the boasting aspect. Almost every single day of my stay in Melbs, some Melbournian boasts to me about how Melbourne is the most livable city in the world-- it was the most annoying thing to hear. (So annoying to hear how Melbourne would've been the capital city if it weren't for Sydney-- just deal with the fact that the capital is ACT! No need to mention it on official tours!) People on the streets aren't too friendly- bump into someone and they give you the dirties. One thing that is really concerning is (the lack of) road rules. I saw a whole group of people jaywalking right in front of some police officers, but the officers didn't even care. Drivers are generally inconsiderate (of pedestrians amd other vehicles) at intersections. It's a little unsafe. And the weather is just atrocious.

One little thing that also got on my nerves (but it may be a positive thing for others) is the design of the roads. Almost every street of Melbourne looks the same and that's confusing. A lot of people seem to complain about Sydney roads but it's made my life easier in terms of identifying which area I'm in.

(Has anyone noticed that Melbourne TV isn't very multicultural??? Plus Melbourne's Chinatown does not feel like China at all- just a poor mockery of it. The museum is cool and the decorations are a nice touch, but something about Sydney's Chinatown feels a little more authentic- it's probably the carts.)

All in all, I reckon Melbourne is a great tourist destination. It's honestly such an interesting place. But in general, Sydney is better for living.
2yrs+
rosah
rosah I agree, the last time I visited Melbourne I had so many people at restaurants and in the hotel boast about Melbourne to me and tell me that Sydney has no culture. I think people who have lived in Melbourne their whole lives have this image of Sydney where the only restaurants and cafes are on the harbour or in the CBD but little do they know that the inner Sydney suburbs like Enmore, Petersham, St Peters, Erskineville, Marrickville are bustling with culture, amazing food and bars/pubs. When going to these suburbs you also get to the experience the multicultural side to Sydney where you can indulge in amazing food like Vietnamese, Greek, Malaysian, Portuguese, Egyptian etc the list can go on. Take me to get a cheap bowl of dumplings and good beer in Enmore over those daggy restaurants on the Harbour any day. Not to mention the fantastic beaches that Sydney has to offer - the first time I saw St Kilda beach I almost laughed when I saw people trying lay on the rocky sand in 16 degree weather. Don't get me wrong, I think Melbourne has great nightlife along with it's funky restaurants and cafes in the side alleys but in Sydney you can find equally the same amount of funky restaurants. Obviously everyone is going to be bias as to where they live but I definitely don't feel like I'm missing out on anything by living in Sydney.
Aug 28, 2019
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JohnT3 2yrs+
Born in England, lived five years in Melbourne and three in Sydney I think I am qualified to give an unbiast final answer to this never ending debate.
Taking into account, landscape ,diversity , features , food, people, culture, weather, transport ,facilities ,there is one city that wins the lot, by a country mile.....
and the winner is Sydney!!!!
End of debate
7 votes
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Jason Spencer
Jason Spencer What suburbs did you live in?
2yrs+
sarap2
sarap2 Totally agree. Was a boarder from the country and spent 4 years in Melbourne. It seemed so grey and dark. I couldn't move to Sydney fast enough and have been in love with her for the last 30 years. She is friendly, pretty, kind and everyone comes to visit her.
Now, when I go back to Melbourne I see that she has grown into herself and used the grey and dark to her advantage and makes her seem so mysterious and desirable. Nobody sends out humour to the rest of Australia quite like the Melbourne people and that I will be forever thankful for.
2yrs+
Krishiv K
Krishiv K John T3
just shut up already!
stop spreading rumors like your in grade 6
May 04, 2020
Happy Bunni Hihihi
Happy Bunni Hihihi I agree Krishiv K John T3
Jul 05, 2020
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Melbourne wins hands down!

Melbourne is the city of sport, culture, food, nightlife and beauty.

Sydney is a great holiday, but to live Melbourne wins every time!
6 votes
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Krishiv K
Krishiv K JUST ADDING, MELBOURNE IS THE EDUCATION STATE
May 04, 2020
dannyp1
dannyp1 Obviously you aren't being provided with quality education if you're calling Melbourne a state. Last time I checked NSW attracts more international and domestic students, has a greater number of world class universities, has higher research output overall and higher quality secondary schools based on standardised testing scores.

What does the education state even mean? Is it supposed to be another marketing gimmick like the most liveable city in the world, because one economic magazine called you that? Oh yeah, that's right it's just another self-proclaimed title made by Melbourians for Melbourians. Not sure I have come across another population of people who are so full of themselves. Embarrasing.
May 04, 2020
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BecP 2yrs+
I am not sure anyone needs to be in a competition. People are people. Cities have their own feel according to the energy of the people inhabiting or travelling to it at that particular time. It is the perspective of the individual that makes a place what it is.
5 votes
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Krishiv K
Krishiv K NO NO NO
May 04, 2020
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CommunityMan 2yrs+
They really are quite different so it comes down to what you like and what is important to you. Both have some wonderful areas to enjoy.
5 votes
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rizr 2yrs+
I moved to Melbourne 3 months ago and spent 3 years in Sydney. I have moved because of cheap housing, Sydney is too expensive to buy your own property. Otherwise every box tick for Sydney. Best weather, really awesome transport, Beaches infact everything. Melbourne claim to have good transport but it's really bad, trains get cancelled and it's really normal/common that train will get late. Bad transport system. Bus lanes are hardly there. Melbourne claim less cost of living but salaries are less too. Sydney wins.
4 votes
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Syd James Aug 07, 2019
I lived in both and in my experience

11 years in Sydney
Sydney is the most spectacular city in Australia with its amazing harbour views, better weather and the picturesque beaches. It would be more my kind of city but I find the people superficial and soulless. Worst kind of people I met in my life are unfortunately from Sydney.

Melbourne 26 years
Melbourne is the most hippest, coolest and liveable city in Australia with countless well maintained parks, reserves, sporting facilities, amazing markets, cafes, neighbourhoods and nightlife. I prefer it more because people in general are friendlier and have a soul. Best people I met in my life are from Melbourne.
3 votes
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Syd James
Syd James Further to this, Sydney in my opinion has some of best suburbs in oz with spectacular harbour and beach views and many of the worst suburbs in oz where most people reside in the west. Sydney is better if you are rich and upper middle class.
Melbourne has many of the hippest and coolest suburbs in oz and on average most people live in suburbs that are of better standard than Sydney. Melbourne is better if you are upper middle class, middle class and lower middle class.
Aug 08, 2019
harleyj
harleyj Am from Sydney and now live in WA. Can confirm Sydney people are the worst. Moving to Melbourne in two weeks tho, time will tell how the Melburnians take me and I them. WA people are rad if anyone wants to know.
Nov 19, 2019
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oceank Feb 23, 2019
This is literally just a thread of people hating on Melbourne. I live here, this is my home, I'm in love with this place, lay off my city man, you don't see many Melbournians openly hating on Sydney do you?
3 votes
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richardb27
richardb27 In my experience, Sydneysiders don't have particularly strong opinions on the topic, are comfortable with the positives and negatives of their city, and appreciate Melbourne's particular charms, whereas I have found Melbournians are far more likely to be hung up about the rivalry, and obsessed with arguing why Melbourne is better (in fact, I would suggest the rivalry is only a thing in the Southern capital). I would suggest this has long historical roots, back to Melbourne's founding as a settlement for free settlers, without the convict stain of Sydney, Hobart, Launceston, Brisbane (and of course Mudgee, on whose street plan Melbourne was based!!!), and fuelled by Melbourne's incredible rapid transformation in the mid 19th century from a sleepy settlement to a grand Victorian city built on the vast wealth generated by the Victorian goldfields, and Victoria gaining independence from NSW. In terms of most livable city, that of course takes into account a number of factors, including housing costs, which work in Melbourne's favour; both cities are very liveable, and it boils down to what you prefer or value more, for example, the sport or the weather, the beach or the art gallery, etc. I love visiting Melbourne, however I prefer to live in Sydney for several reasons. For example, Sydney's climate is a bit more liveable taking the whole year into account - the weather is more predictable, winter is milder, the ocean temperatures make swimming comfortable all year round (even if the winter surf can be a bit unfriendly), it has twice the rainfall but half the rainy days, and at the height of summer, at least the city and eastern half of metropolitan area are milder than Melbourne due to the prevailing easterly sea breezes (and if you love heat, you can head to the far west and enjoy Penrith smashing heat records out of the park!!!). Sydney's topography is quite special - not only the harbour, waterways and beaches (is there a city with more surf beaches than Sydney, let alone all of the harbour and bay beaches), but the incredibly varied topography of the city and suburbs - not very bicycle friendly, particularly if you ride a hipster fixed gear bike, but with a great deal of visual interest, and very different from the relatively flat nature of not only Melbourne but many other cities in Europe, North America and elsewhere. Sydney is in what is known as a botanical hotspot, an area with incredible diversity and number of plant species and communities, and is lucky to have preserved a significant amount of the original vegetation, particularly in the Hawkesbury Sandstone communities of the northern and southern suburbs and harbour foreshore - much of this forms part of the significant number of national parks and reserves within the urban area, and added to this, Sydney is ringed by significant national parks, not only on both sides of Broken Bay and the Hawkesbury River, but also the Royal National Park to the South, arguably the oldest in the world, and the World Heritage national parks of the Blue Mountains - on a sunny day, Sydney does live up to the moniker The Emerald City. Sydney has some architectural gems (as well as plenty of architectural turds, but I think that can be said of any city!) - apart from the Opera House and Bridge, the historically significant buildings along Macquarie Street (including the World Heritage Hyde Park Barracks), the cathedrals, Town Hall and remarkable Queen Victoria Building, the 19th century government building in and around Bridge St, Macquarie St and Hyde Park, Central Station, and the rich record of successive development over the city's 232 years of European settlement (and Sydney's sandstone, whilst soft and high maintenance, gives a beautiful warmth to many of the buildings). Whilst Sydney's roads are often too narrow and congested (a downside to Sydney's topography and its organic development over the last couple of centuries), its public transport system is superior on the strength of the more extensive rail network, dedicated bus lanes, and the metro lines now operating and under construction (just don't mention the Eastern Suburbs Light Rail, though on a positive note the carriages are so lovely and shiny red!!!!!!) Now for Melbourne. much of Inner Melbourne reflects the wealth of the second half of the 19th century, with many very beautiful public buildings as well as wide streets of grand and not so grand Victorian terraces and workers cottages in suburbs like North and South Melbourne, Carlton, Albert Park etc. Inner Melbourne's public parks and gardens are extensive and in many ways more beautiful than Sydney's equivalents (not to denigrate at all Sydney's Botanic Gardens, Domain or Australia's oldest public park, Hyde Park, but Melbourne parks are very much in the European tradition with their mature avenues of elms, oaks etc). The city is much more planned, and many of the contemporary buildings have more visual interest - Sydney's high rise are designed to look out from, whereas Melbourne's are designed to be looked at, in many ways! Melbourne certainly does have a more European feel as a city environment, from topography to layout, architecture and mix of businesses. Melbourne's cultural institutions are also reflective of the wealth of Late Victorian Melbourne, with the National Gallery's collection being on par with many of the provincial galleries of Europe (ie outside of the major institutions like the National Gallery in London, the Louvre, Prado, Hermitage, Uffizi etc), and the Reading Room of the State Library being a wonderful space. Melbourne's retail and food cultures are definitely something to appreciate - certainly the clothes offering are much better, the Queen Victoria Markets are wonderful, there are many great cafes, bars and restaurants in and around the city and inner suburbs, and Melbourne has certainly led Australia's claim to having some of the best coffee in the world (although it is hard to argue anything is better than the coffee in Italy, Melbourne's would be a close second), I am also a big fan of the Dandenongs, Arthur's Seat and Wilson's Promontory in terms of the natural environment. No city in Australia is as sports obsessed as Melbourne - the AFL draws the fourth largest average weekly crowds of any sporting code on the planet, and the major sporting venues are world class (and of course the G is simply awe inspiring, in spite of its history of suspect pitches in recent decades!!!) The trams are lovely, particularly the historic ones, and the free tram zone is great, although in the suburbs where trams share the roads with traffic they can lead to road congestion and inefficiency (in some ways it is a shame Sydney decommissioned its tram network in the early '60s as it was twice as extensive as Melbourne's, however the narrow roads in Sydney's CBD were not conducive to trams with the rise of car use). Negatives? The outer suburbs of both cities are poorly serviced and often suffer from a range of social issues, and governments need to do a lot more to improve livability in these areas in both cities. Culturally, in some ways Melbourne is a more conservative city and Sydney more progressive, which is reflected in various cultural aspects of each city, and certainly the pace of life is a little more frenetic in Sydney, but I don't think some of the comments here are supportable in terms of the gross generalisations made - I am certain both cities have friendly and unfriendly, informed and ignorant, shallow and (I am reluctant to use the word deep!), caring and uncaring people in fairly equal measure. As a fairly small nation in terms of populatio,n we should be very grateful to have two such liveable citie s of international standard. Sure the nightlife in many cities overseas leaves both Sydney and Melbourne for dead, but at the end of the day, we don't work and raise our families in nightclubs and bars, and the natural and built environments, access to good quality fresh food, healthcare, education, and a decent minimum wage is more important in my books. Sure, we can learn from many cities overseas in terms of developing more vibrant city centres, particularly after dark, but at the end of the day, Australian cities are fundamentally suburban in a way most cities elsewhere are not, and we need to work within these parameters. Here's to Australia's two great metropolises (sorry Brisbane, I do have a lot of time for you, but you aren't in Sydney and Melbourne's league just yet!)
Feb 25, 2020
claire-sessionss
claire-sessionss richardb27 this is the best comment I've read in ages on anything :)
Feb 26, 2020
Happy Bunni Hihihi
Jul 05, 2020
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tommyj1 2yrs+
I've grown up in Sydney and travelled extensively (I'm also educated and can spell, unlike most people on this site) ...

My family are from established European wealth on my mother's side. They are all professionals. Culture, art, education and the finer things in life have all played a large part in our upbringing.

Sydney is a vacuous, shallow city, full of people who come from impoverished backgrounds and, as such, prize wealth and materialism above everything else. Who cares about a harbour and beaches?! 90% of Sydney's population lives in the Western Suburbs and most of the people who frequent the beaches are some of the most brain-dead posers you will ever encounter.

As for all these ridiculous comparisons to NY and LA - why are Australians so obsessed with America?? It's a crass, shallow country with a shocking social system and people getting shot all the time. Law degrees cost $150,000 with no job prospects, the society couldn't care less about the collective, only the individual - look at their President!

It's about time Australians develop a brain and revert to following Britain and Europe for moral and cultural guidance.
3 votes
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Ricardo Fuente
Ricardo Fuente lol did you forget again to take your daily pill?
Mar 04, 2020
steve-moores
steve-moores Why does Australia need to follow anyone?
May 01, 2020
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TanayyT 2yrs+
I think its very difficult to say which is better . Sydney looks gorgeous during the day as well as in the night. Melbourne can give a little isolated feeling. But it really depends on your taste.. I feel the weather is Sydney is extremely hot and humid in the summers but Melbourne is a lot more pleasant. Nightlife- Sydney wins hands down but restaurants and cafes are better in Melbourne. Also less beggars in Melbourne. The beaches is splendid in and around Sydney. Public transport is better in Melbourne . Also Melbourne is better to raise your family. So Sydney 7/10 and Melbourne 8/10
3 votes
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Jason Spencer
Jason Spencer Which city do you live in TanayyT?
2yrs+
TanayyT
TanayyT I travel to Australia often... And have family living in Sydney and Melbourne .. I am from Bombay, India.
2yrs+
mattf
mattf Agreed
2yrs+
iok
iok Nightlife? In Sydney??? Lol....hahahaha
2yrs+
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GregS 2yrs+
To compare Melbourne to New York is simply laughable. New York is a vibrant 24/7 place, shops and restaurants are are always open. Walking through the Melbourne CBD a few weeks ago on a Saturday night was depressing. In the Docklands, the premier tourist site, everything was closed at 8pm. Melbourne is more like the UK's Birmingham in the 50's. Poor, and in some cases rude or even openly hostile customer service attitude abounds in most shops. Not to mention the aging, falling apart at the seams rail network. Sydney on the other hand is like being in another universe.
3 votes
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CraigB1
CraigB1 Yeah, I hate the Melbourne to NYC comparison. What an insult to New York
2yrs+
CamillaH
CamillaH That's exactly what I thought when I saw that comment. Hysterical.
2yrs+
PerrinL
PerrinL I live in Melbourne, you just have to know where to go when at night. I found NYC freaky coz there was creeps running around with guns. Melbourne is the Most Livable City since 2011. Melbournians are very friendly people, they're were probably 'mean' to you because you insulted their city. Melbournians love their city...
2yrs+
Zelda Booth
Zelda Booth Melburnians overate their city! They think so much of what little it has!
2yrs+
Stuart Mitchell
Stuart Mitchell The Dockland are not the Premier tourist site.... maybe you should have gone into the city..the laneways the funky bars that are open after 1pm. No Melbourne isn't NYC but it allot more like it than Sydney.
2yrs+
TimT
TimT Sydney is extremely similar to LA, but with a harbor.
2yrs+
johnc75
johnc75 Docklands - Premier tourist site ? Come on no-one thinks it is anything other than a disaster! Used around the world as an a example of how NOT to do urban planning
Feb 01, 2019
fezp
fezp The Docklands is a wasteland. Every Melbournian knows that. The fact that you were there (instead of other places) on a Saturday night says more about your lack of knowledge of the city than anything else
Aug 23, 2019
Gamingwith cyborgcool24
Gamingwith cyborgcool24 You are all eggheads, your all so opinionated and so defensive you cant look at the bright side of things, you know now I understand why humanity is doomed
Feb 20, 2020
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Sydney, actually the outskirts of Sydney. The beaches are better then Victoria
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Marko R Feb 28, 2019
The beaches are better in Sydney, however, the nightlife in Melb is far better. Unfortunately for Sydney, since the introduction of the lock out laws, the nightlife is quite sad in the CBD.
2 votes
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AdamS
AdamS Did the lockout laws actually change anything? Are the streets any better now than before?
Feb 28, 2019
Marko R
Marko R From a safety perspective, I guess it's an improvement but only for the very reason that there are not as many people on the streets...the likes of Newtown and Double Bay is where it's at as they fall outside of the lockout law radius.
Mar 01, 2019
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Jason Spencer Feb 28, 2019
As a weekly visitor to Sydney the traffic is much worse than Melbourne. Horrible commute times getting worse each month.
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Jimmyq
Jimmyq Sydney roads are without doubt the worst in Australia.....but the Western Suburbs are not too bad (but i wouldnt want to live there...maybe Castle Hill).
Nov 12, 2019
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jj8 2yrs+
All the Melbourne haters are lame, the result says it all most livable city in the word 7 times and will continue watch. I lived in both cities. Melbourne wins! For fashion, people, art, culture, sporting events. Gold rush happened in Melbourne, we were once the capital city till Sydney had a cry (Syd your butts down), so Canberra became the capital. It was never Sydney. Oh largest casino in the sounthern hemisphere by the yarra, fashion capital city and capital city for sports, affordable housing, lower crime rates, cheaper in every way and same wages, better transportation, better people, Eureka tower, eiffel tower look a like art centre, beautiful cbd, hip and classy, way more history, not so humid like Sydney, better night life, the apostles/great ocean road, federation square, beautiful cathedrals Sydney got nothing as good, we got beautiful beaches to, melbourne show, wayyyy better airport, better city layout, better tv shows, Australian legend Steve Irwin was originally from Melbourne, beauriful libraries and way better universities. I'm stating facts, shove your feels Sydney ppl. Always hating on Melbourne, but hey stop being jealous and just move. The stats don't lie.. My city is the most livable, that Sydney could never deny, 7 times and current??? Whoa that couldn't be an accident. Oh deadliest spiders are from Sydney, so be wise and choose Melbourne!
2 votes
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neilk3
neilk3 Melbourne was only the capital AFTER Sydney, mate. You're list has a few good points though. Can't agree with the Casino (gambling isn't something to gloat about), Apostles/Great Ocean Road aren't Melbourne or you can add 50+ more beaches to Sydney. Most of your other points are reasonably valid or I can't argue as I haven't lived in Melbourne.
One thing Melbournites do that irks me though is constantly trying to claim they're better than Sydney. Melbourne might be good, but it's not good enough to try and lord it over other cities.
2yrs+
peterl36
peterl36 Totally agree!!! I am from Sydney and I love it! I also think Melbourne is a wonderful Australian city. I always enjoy a visit there!!! However, people in Sydney don't seem to care about this silly comparison! We love our sister city Melbourne for all it's wonderful features. However, it's only been while in Melbourne that I here and have received criticism of my city of Sydney. Melbourne stop being so defensive! What's wrong with you. We don't care in Sydney!!! We love you too!!! Every time I have visited Melbourne and spoken to a stranger...the moment I say I'm d from Sydney they become defensive!!!
Dec 04, 2018
janb2
janb2 Best city in the world? Ha. Ha. Ha. When you are a little frog in a pond and cannot see out, one thinks their pond is the best pond in the swamp. Melbourne is nothing but a dusty grungy dangerous dump and the premier needs to not only get real about the crime here but also order the councils to weed and mow the overgrown grass around the place (everywhere!!) so that when a storm comes, people don't die from asthma pollen!! The whole place needs cleaning up its a disgrace. While Im at it - re-paint all the faded white lines on the road so drivers can see where they are going. As soon as my girls leave school in a few years I'm moving straight back to Sydney. In fairness though, a lot more support could come from Canberra to help this nanny state spruce up a little. NSW seems to get everything.
Dec 04, 2018
sharpear
sharpear Haha this is the best comment ever, I loved reading it! All in all it totally depends on what sort of person you are and by that I mean what you actually value. The vast majority of comments on here are projections of other peoples values, so distill the facts, understand what you value out of a city and test it out for yourself. Personally, my partner and I value weather highly and living in Melbourne the past 18 months has been tough on us because of this. We're looking to make the move to Sydney and see if a change in weather makes all the difference as we suspect. We're also not super connected in Melbourne as much as we'd like to be, it is harder to make genuine connections as you get older and times get busier, which I am sure makes an decent impact also on an experience.
Sep 28, 2019
richardb27
richardb27 jj8, I think you need to research the history of European settlement and of Federation - Sydney was the capital of NSW when all of the continent other than WA (New Holland) was part of NSW. Melbourne was part of NSW until Victoria was granted independence in 1851, so I am sorry to inform you that Sydney was the capital of what is now Victoria from 1788 until 1851. In the discussions preceding Federation, it was agreed the nation's capital would be within NSW but at least 100 miles from Sydney - this was reflective of the tension at the time between NSW, which was by that stage again the biggest economy and most populous colony (state) and was very open in terms of international trade as opposed to the other colonies (states) which were at that time very protectionist in their policies. This was very much a compromise position, but I think both cities should be very grateful that neither are the capital city, and that we can leave all the nonsense to Canberra! The Constitution stated parliament would sit in Melbourne until the national capital was established, which was initially expected to be only for about 3 years, but it wasn't until 1908 that the site of Canberra was chosen, and 1927 that parliament first sat there. At no point was Melbourne the capital until Sydney had a dummy spit! No gold in any commercial quantity has ever been mined in Melbourne, Melbourne just benefited from the gold mined elsewhere in Victoria - and it may pay be remember that the NSW Gold Rush, although no where near as extensive, preceded Victoria's. Much as St Paul's and St Patrick's are beautiful cathedrals, it is very hard to argue that St Mary's, by the same architect as St Patrick's, is inferior to them, being by far the largest cathedral in Australia, and of great beauty and architectural merit (St Andrews is also very fine in terms of its architectural detail, although much smaller than the other 3). Universities - as beautiful as the colleges at Melbourne Uni are, it has nothing remotely to compare to the Great Hall, Mclaurin Hall and Main Quadrangle at Sydney Uni, which of course is Australia's oldest; both are ranked very highly on international rankings, with Melbourne currently slightly above Sydney, although Sydney ranks higher in terms of international surveys of employer rankings of graduates, and Sydney Uni's Fischer Library has the largest collection in the Southern Hemisphere. And as for the biggest casino in the Southern Hemisphere, you are more than welcome to that honour!!!!
Feb 26, 2020
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khoderl 2yrs+
MELBOURNE HAS BEEN VOTED MOST LIVABLD CITY 6 TIMES IN A ROW. WE'RE MORE SAFER NICER AND BETTER SHOPPING. #Biggestshoppingcentreinaustaliamelbourne
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richardb27
richardb27 ... by the Economist Intelligence Unit, which is one of several rankings that set out to measure livability (which of course is not synonymous with "best"). As of the 2019, Vienna has been in top spot for 2 years, with Melbourne second and Sydney third (on account of housing affordability, otherwise it would have taken 2nd spot). Both cities are very liveable on a global level, and both have their positives and negatives. As Vienna has also topped the Mercer Quality of Living survey for the past decade (Auckland at 3 trumps Sydney at 11 and Melbourne at 17 in the 2019 survey, by the way!!), it could be argued Vienna is superior in terms of livability. Why Vienna ranks so highly has a lot to do with the planning the authorities put in to ensuring housing availability/affordability and other amenities such as transport, including restricting cars from the centre of the city (sadly this seems unthinkable in the Australian context!!). Personally, Vienna is not one of my favourite European cities as a visitor, which just goes to show that livability is not the same as likeability, which is far more subjective and less measurable! From an aesthetic perspective give me an Italian city any day with all its chaos and lack of livability over a Northern European city with its order and amenity. Australia's major cities are all very liveable in global terms, which you prefer comes down to your own personal tastes, likes and interests.
Mar 02, 2020
Silvia Schaffner-Eder
Silvia Schaffner-Eder @richardb27 - you are absolutely right - I never understood the liveability of Vienna being ranked so high (being Austrian) - until moving here ... now after living here for more than 5 years I see a lot of reason for it in great achievements of authorities and administration bodies... - but also cultural aspects, community, nature,... there are so many things one does experience in a different way when living in a city. So I'd say Sydney won the prize for me after not even 2 years living there... - now having spent pretty much the same amount of years in each city, I'd say the overall package really is better in Vienna... (despite not having the ocean and nice climate)... thanks for your insightful comments! cheers, Silvia
Mar 02, 2020
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JenP 2yrs+
Melbourne just won the most liveable city (again) so it looks like it's been decided! Here's the URL for you: http://www.melbourne.vic.gov.au/AboutCouncil/MediaReleases/Pages/Melbournetheworldsmostliveablecity.aspx
2 votes
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VaughanElphick
VaughanElphick Who cares about the most liveable city, prices are down and it is more affordable because it is less in demand.
2yrs+
janb2
janb2 Yes and who is voting this 'liveable city title'? Nobody asked me! Honestly laughable how Melbourne got the medal.
Feb 28, 2020
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Shopping in Melbourne is now much better than Sydney. It definitely moves in cycles. For years Melbourne peaked, then Sydney with its Westfield in Pitt St overtook Melbourne. Now Melbourne with its Emporium, Melbourne Central and Myer/David Jones all connected is much better.

Dining in Melbourne is also better, I am going to start a new thread comparing this one.
2 votes
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KimC 2yrs+
I just visited Melbourne recently, and it was very difficult to find anything. To visit I would definitely say Sydney is a better, as you can find everything really easily, and the beaches are better in Sydney!!!
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melbournefan 2yrs+
Melbourne, without a doubt. Melbourne is New York as Sydney is to Los Angeles. Melbourne is a classy, sophisticated, refined city with beautiful historical architecture, superior shopping, restaurants and nightlife. Sydney feels like a tourist city - dependent on the cliched Harbour Bridge, Opera House and Rocks to drive it's importance.

And while Melbourne might get cold during winter - Sydney's summer humidity can be just as troubling.

And let's not start on home affordability!
2 votes
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Daisybelle
Daisybelle I really can't see the comparison between Melbourne and New York. If any thing Sydney is far more New York and at a pinch Melbourne is more likened to the more introverted London. Temperature is also an unfortunates comparison. The Victorian capital this summer has had temperatures soaring above 30C for long periods over Jan/Feb. Sydney on the other hand has enjoyed pleasant temps ranging below 30C. I won't even go into a comparison re last winter.
2yrs+
CraigB1
CraigB1 I don't really think weather is a problem in fact, the cold in Melbourne is beautiful but I don't know if you've ever been to New York but Sydney actually physically looks like New York. Don't forget New York and Melbourne are in different countries. It's very sad Melbourners always have to compare themselves to other cities.
2yrs+
CamillaH
CamillaH Trust me, Melbourne is like a shit, far less expensive version of London. I've spent enough time living in both.
2yrs+
sarap2
sarap2 I love the Sydney weather. Cold in for their very short winters and then lovely and warm for the rest of the year with a touch of Singapore in Jan / Feb. I love it.
2yrs+
joelg
joelg Sydney is like a girl in her late teens in a short dress with loads of make up on out for a good time. Melbourne is like a cultured middle aged woman who dresses conservatively and is understated. Have lived in Sydney and its surrounds my whole life and visited Melbourne often. Aesthetically, Sydney has it over Melbourne but Sydney siders are often aggressive and the city has an inflated sense of its own self worth. Melbourne maintains its parks and old buildings whereas Sydney will build a car park and erect some ugly apartments.
2yrs+
bellaf3
bellaf3 Ew Joel
2yrs+
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claire-sessionss Oct 21, 2019
I grew up in Sydney, lived in Melbourne for five years (from age 25-30) and brought my Melbourne boyfriend back to Sydney.
When anyone says 'all Sydney people are superficial, you can't get good coffee' my eyes almost roll out of my head. When living in Melbourne I certainly picked up a Sydney hating vibe from some, not all (mostly inner northies, but then they tended to also hate anywhere in Melb that wasn't the inner north!). Melbourne is a great place to live, definitely more easily walkable than Sydney. Great cafes, bars, live music, community activities, I love the markets there. I lived there while studying and 20% (maybe even 30%) cheaper rent made my life a bit easier.
Like any place full of humans there are nice people and dickheads. I grew up on the upper north shore of Sydney (very pretty but boring) and now live in the inner west. Those two places are extremely different, so when people say something like 'Sydney is hectic' I feel like 'which part are you talking about?' I think when people compare the two cities they often don't compare like for like, they compare the price of dumplings in Melb's chinatown to the price of dinner in Darling Habour (who even goes there!?). I love living in Sydney, and the rental/real estate price difference has been offset by me and my partner earning more. We've found a great neighbourhood, nice friends, we have favourite local cafes and bars and are fortunate enough to have set up our lives where our commutes are great (I walk 30 mins, my partner trains for 40). I miss the general walkability of Melbourne, and when I lived in Melbourne I missed the green, lush, junglyness of Sydney and the beaches. They're both great cities. For me, the weather pushes me to Sydney but visiting Melbourne to me is like visiting an old friend. Let's not hate peeps :)
1 vote
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dannyp1 Nov 14, 2018
Melbourne relies on one publication to claim most liveable city in the world and sadly misinterprets it as the best city in the world. The worst part of it is that every Melburnian will refer to this at least 50x in a brain washing exercise, how embarrassing. I think Melbourne has been trying to reclaim its status as the most populous/important city for over 100 years when it peaked during the gold rush. The government is now over developing the cbd with an outdated monocentric model, no population cap/standards, would take aliens from outer space if it could to grow. Still generating about $100billion less in GDP than Sydney which means lower waves/ less wealth. The powers of the police force in Melbourne are borderline alarming, they can't exercise their rights to do their jobs properly. So many lefty socialists ready to guilt you into any debate about globalisation and humanitarianism. They're deeply obsessed with their city. In fact Melbourne's biggest fans are Melbournians. It's akin to a child coming home with a star in their workbook and then believing from this they can become an astronaut. One thing that Melbournians will surely do when you visit/move there is boast, compare and criticise.
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chrisb17 2yrs+
I live in Brisbane and love visiting both cities. I think Sydney has a bit more variety than Melbourne. Places like Surry Hills, Newtown, Potts Point, Bondi, Manly all have their own unique feel and identity, whereas Melbourne feels the same everywhere you go. In saying that Melbourne is easier to get around and has a better and more welcoming CBD. Sydney CBD is overly dense and claustrophobic. For natural beauty its no contest, Sydney wins hands down. Sydney has a better airport and the commute into central is very good, Melbourne is still living in the 80s in this respect. Even Brisbane has an air-train.
People in Melbourne generally seem to be nicer and more down to earth than in Sydney, but they are more parochial. Both cities have culture, it all depends on what you like.
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danted 2yrs+
Melbourne has great sporting arenas, pubs..but my god so many beggars in the cbd .graffiti ar every train station from flinders to Frankston.and what's with all those level crossings !! Trams are so slow it's quicker to walk . But I got to say the Brazilian coffee is just great
1 vote
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Emily ! 2yrs+
for the people saying melbourne is cold last summer it was the hottest in australia with 5 days in a row of over 45 degree heat. in my opinion sydney is a tourist city where as melbs is a better place to live.
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Impact 2yrs+
You can't compare Sydney and Melbourne. Sydney is like a Ferrari, Melbourne is like a fast Honda. It's not even close. The only similiarties is that they have 4 million people which is similar to our population. They also have cheap house prices and good bus and after hours transport. Our transport is ok, our house prices are very expensive. Also we have more wealthy people, they have allot more low and medium income, so petty crime and attitude is common there. Hipsters have taken over Melbourne and claim their coffee is good, that's coffee which is imported from Brazil.

If you're new to this debate, just know that Sydney is a 9/10, Melbourne is a 4/10. Gold Coast is better place to live than Melbourne, and so is Brisbane.
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Sue Seivers 2yrs+
Easy question, rural is the best with loads of fresh food that hasn't been in cold storage, amazing trees which are individual and have many different colours and textures, large open fields to play any sport you like even motor sports, birds that fly freely and skies filled with brilliant stars, the feeling of relaxation, peace and space all on an easy budget, aways many fun things to do and fantastic moments to enjoy.
1 vote
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I found out that Melbourne will be Australia future generation biggest city instead of Sydney. When I was here, Sydney was Australia biggest city and now we are losing the title to another city that I don't know much about, I know Sydney more than Melbourne. #SydneySider
1 vote
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DanS4 2yrs+
Born and raised in Sydney, lived here for most of my life and have wanted to leave for as long as i can remember. There's too many people, nobody cares about one-another, the lifestyle is superficial, and most business's close at 5pm. I have to say however, that the beaches anywhere else just dont compare. Sydney has amazing beaches, relatively decent work opportunities, and the weather is nice.
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TimT 2yrs+
I found the traffic in Melbourne some of the worst I've ever experienced, and friends who live there confirmed this to be the case...they bike everywhere they can.

Melbourne wins the wine battle...Hunter Valley a fun diversion, Mornington Peninsula and Yarra Valley are simply amazing.

It always amazes me how Sydneysiders complain about their rail and bus system, it's pretty awesome to me.

As an Angelino, Sydney feels like home, Melbourne is more like San Francisco. Melbourne has cooler weather, hipsters wearing black, and provincial 'tude, just like SF.
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Zelda Booth
Zelda Booth TimT, I live in Sydney and travels a lot to Melbourne as well as San Fran. San Francisco is way prettier than Melbourne.
2yrs+
Em Fowell
Em Fowell Zelda Booth how can you afford to do that - as "and travels a lot to Melbourne as well as San Fran" implies you do very often and that sounds really pricey af $$$... to do so! I don't think persons getting antsy really need do so, re: comparisons to the international cities it's not hurting anyone to see some similarities between them - they never made claims of them being 100% a like afterall!..
2yrs+
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MrAlexandria 2yrs+
LA and New York? Really???

I would have thought :
Sydney is to San Fran as Melbourne is to Boston.
Sydney has the high rise, Melbourne has the old architecture.
Sydney has the beaches, Melbourne has a frigid bay.
Sydneysiders Surf, Melbournians wear overcoats.
In Sydney you can eat well, in Melbourne the food is world class.

And besides that:
Greater Melbourne has a wider variety of shopping regions to visit (in the CBDs themselves its pretty similar)
Sydney has a better code of football :) Go the Dragons!
Melbourne has better roads and transport
Sydney never sleeps (whereas Melbourne feels dead after 10pm)
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AssadA 2yrs+
Melbourne has a polluted, sickening brown Yarra river running right through the middle. Druggies everywhere in the CBD, murder every day on the streets and not even a rail link to the airport.
SYD wins everytime!!
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KasiaB
KasiaB hahah pretty sure there isn't murder everyday ..
2yrs+
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DarGeo 2yrs+
Lol.. Only a Melbourne person would actually answer "Melbourne" to this.

Any neutral person would obviously rate Sydney as the better suburb.

As a guideline, a fair rating would be Sydney: 9.5 out of 10 Melbourne 7.5 out of 10
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LizaS
LizaS Im not from either but I've been to both! Melbourne was awesome and Sydney was boring...
If superficial is your thing then Sydney for sure
2yrs+
Monica Guo
Monica Guo I can't keep reading after your first stupid sentence... srsly. Get a grip.
2yrs+
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walkability 2yrs+
I really don't like the comparison of Sydney/LA to Melbourne/New York. I lived in Sydney and in Los Angeles, and I visited Melbourne and New York - I do see how people would like to compare them, but really there is absolutely NO comparison between Sydney and LA, maybe the average temperatures year round... I love Sydney and I like Melbourne. Coming from Europe, Sydney was the more exotic destination for us due to the beaches and the warmer climate... If I feel homesick I like to go for a holiday in more European Melbourne...
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TimT
TimT I've lived in Los Angeles for nearly 30 years, and grew up spending a lot of time in New York. I've only visited Melbourne thrice, but have a lot of friends in Sydney and visit there often.

From this Seppo's point of view, having spent a lot of time in all four cities, Sydney is Los Angeles' psychic twin, and my Sydneysider friends agree. The major difference is that Sydney has the harbor, in that they are more like San Francisco, but in every other way, it's a smaller version of LA. And I love my city, so I don't think that's a bad thing!

Melbourne absolutely reminds me of New York, although the laneways are really like nowhere else I've been. It's also a fantastic city, but I feel more at home in Sydney.
2yrs+
chrisb17
chrisb17 Melbourne is nothing like NY and its a cringe worthy comparison. Sydney is also 100x nicer than LA.
2yrs+
Em Fowell
Em Fowell @walkability where in Europa are you from? How did you find Melbourne to be as you depict in your closing sentence... Where in Sydney did you live for how long, ever miss it? Or 100% contented in EU now, in all ways one can be?
2yrs+
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Peter Sutton 2yrs+
For sports, Melbourne wins Hands Down. For all year sunset drinks Sydney is World Class.
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KimC 2yrs+
Yeah, Melbourne does have the grid, but everything is down alleys without any signage so to find anyway decent place to have a good drink or feed was difficult, where in Sydney you can see them everywhere and they tend to be on the main street.

We drove past the beaches, had no inclination to stop as there was zero waves and what fun is a beach without waves. However, I did like the cute cabin/sheds on them.
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jimb14
jimb14 Go to Sorrento for waves.
2yrs+
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AdamS 2yrs+
@KimC what was so hard to find? Melbourne is laid out in a perfect grid like nature, which I can hardly about Sydney's very odd layout. I find it very hard to navigate Sydney (without my iphone of course, then it's a piece of cake). Did you actually visit any of the beaches in Melbourne?

AJ
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Kian Moini Jun 27, 2020
Y'all have clearly never heard of personal preferences-
Sydney has the better harbour, beaches, climate and natural setting.
Melbourne has the better sports, shopping, food and historical buildings
Sydney is more about its tourist attractions and natural beauty while melbourne is more about the city and its culture (such as the many laneways in the CBD)
I personally prefer Melbourne, but I'm grateful to live in Sydney because they're both great cities.
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sydj Mar 06, 2020
Recently having lost weight and becoming a bit fashion conscious I have gotten into overcoats and boots. I use to dread Melbourne winters but now I can't wait for it, I am really looking fwd to wearing my overcoats and boots. Melbourne is better if you are into fashion, shopping, food and coffee. Love visiting the parks and the markets in Melbourne on weekends. Best parks, cafes, eateries, markets, shopping centers, night club's, pubs, hip suburbs, sports/swimming facilities are in Melbourne without a doubt.
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TimT Sep 09, 2019
Sydney has no leather scene, Melbourne is edgier.

https://youtu.be/7QTx38FJpT0
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dannyp1 Aug 31, 2019
Melbourne is great if you're on a budget. Doesn't feel very corporate, feels trashy/messy and a little lawless. There are lots of aggressive junkies around flinders st station. In saying that there are some striking buildings around, and collins street is nice. There's a couple of streets with very concentrated restaurants and bars. but seriously that's about it. I couldn't live there. I would get bored of the handful of laneways after a while. It needs to be about 5 times bigger to be exciting/vibrant city. otherwise you'll just get bored of it. the cbd is too ugly to visit every day. there's no wow factor in melbourne. it doesnt feel iconic and i dont feel excited to be there.

Sydney's cbd is very corporate, busy, crowded especially during the weekday. if you like the buzz/energy of being in a busy city, you only get that in sydney. sydney has malls that connect to other malls that don't seem to end. its incredible for shopping. very concentrated with stores for fashion. sydenysiders dont usually socialise in the cbd, unless they are doing so after work drinks. they usually go out in the local areas to meet with friends. if you want the best bars, clubs, restaurants, cafes, youll need to go to inner city areas like potts point, surry hills, paddington, glebe, newtown, alexandria, redfern, darlinghurst, pyrmont, marrickville etc. last drink lock out laws only apply to the cbd and former red light district kings cross. oxford street and kings cross with its famous coca cola sign was the party capital of australia before the lockout laws. its not the same, but dont think this will last much longer. most of these areas are walking distance to the cbd but are not amongst the towers. the beaches/scenery in sydney are sickening. youll never get enough of it.
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Marko R Feb 28, 2019
I think the beaches are better in Sydney, however, you cannot beat the nightlife that Melb has to offer! Unfortunately for Sydney, since the introduction of the lock out laws - the nightlife in the CBD is quite sad.
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jimb14 2yrs+
Melbourne is probably larger than Sydney now.

Melbourne doesn't include Geelong in the population statistics, even though it is far closer to the CBD than the Central Coast is to Sydney's CBD.
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jimb14 2yrs+
Sydney is humid and smells of stale urine. Melbourne's streets are cleaner. Less tourists may be something to do with this. Sydney feels like a tourist scrum.

Sydney has no answer to Melbourne's Southbank. Southbank is far more impressive than anything Sydney has. Southbank at night is incredible.

Sydney's CBD is less impressive than Melbourne's. Melbourne has a sleeker skyline of glass towers. Sydney's towers see to be squat grey concrete.

Sydney's transport system is far more infuriating than Melbourne's. I have my own car though, but still it's easier to drive around Melbourne.

Melbourne has cooler venues and bars. Sydney has the wow factor of the harbour but beyond that - not a lot to recommend it over Melbourne. Perth has a beautiful harbour in front of it like Sydney but so what? A large body of water does not a city make.
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chrisb17
chrisb17 Southbank is nothing special...
Melbourne has no famous beaches like bondi or manly. Melbourne has no suburbs like potts point which is full of old luxury art deco appartments. Melbourne didnt start building appartments until the 70s, hence theyre all cheap and ugly, meanwhile sydney was building appartments in the 1920s and 30s. Sydney has secondary cbd's in parramatta and chatswood. Melbourne just has one central cbd.
Sydney doesnt have any horrible eyesores like federation square that they try to pass it off as a tourist attraction.
2yrs+
jimb14
jimb14 Federation square is a lot less ugly than circular quay. CQ is a urine soaked garbage strewn mess. Melbourne has much nicer suburbs too - South Yarra, Toorak, Brighton. Brighton Beach and the surrounding area is very pretty. And Melbourne's CBD is just a nicer place to walk around. Melbourne skyscrapers are newer and better looking, made of glass. Not concrete like Sydney's ageing, dated CBD.

Sydney had nothing to compete with the Eureka tower. Sydney Skytower is emabassingly dated. It's worse than the Telstra Tower in Canberra.
2yrs+
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czajax5 2yrs+
melbourne is too liberal for me. i would rather stay in sydney.
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GregS 2yrs+
Well well, it's Friday 1st December 2017, some stormy weather and the Melbourne train system is once again in meltown. Every single line in the metro network is either at a standstill or operating at sub 50% of capacity. An at least once a month occurance in Melbourne.
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imrightl 2yrs+
I personally think Sydney can differ in a lot of ways compared to Alice springs as they are in different countries and I do admire culturalism to its full extent and the plane ticket I went and saw a zoo. Rentals are affordable in Melbourne but the goldcoast does have water where beaches are. I think you are all wrong but I am correct.
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Which is safest for single ladies? Also outdoor enthusiast: hiking, biking, running, rock climbing, kayaking, rafting etc ? Have lived in SF and LA so used to pricey. . .as long as it offers something. Anything within 4 or 5 miles I prefer to walk or bike. Sun lover and totally fine with high temps. Spend more time out-and-about during daytime and home at night. Love fresh air, sunshine, and starry night skies 😊

Thanks for your thoughts!
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Zelda Booth 2yrs+
Why even ask? Sydney of course!
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JeffM 2yrs+
Both are average compared to the Gold Coast . Real weather and beaches.
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Bort
Bort You're kidding right? Sydney's beaches are just as nice and Melbourne has way more culture, food...everything than the GC. GC is nice for a holiday with the kids but doesn't compare to either Sydney or Melbourne.
2yrs+
Impact
Impact No I wouldn't agree there. I don't know when you went to the GC. The beaches on the GC are better than any in Sydney. And the place feels like an active fun city, great vibe too. I wouldn't put the GC anywhere near Melbourne as Melbourne is a shithole but GC has Sydney beat in some ways, not in allot of others though.
2yrs+
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IshitaR 2yrs+
Well for me Sydney is the best.
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Sydney has the architecture too. It's just that the touristy spots such as the Opera House and the Harbour Bridge overshadow the fact that Sydney is filled with historic architecture behind its mask - People won't look in for those thanks to their distraction by our landmarks. Melbourne doesn't have any notable landmarks, so of course folks would be like "well they have architecture".
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SamL 2yrs+
I'm a NSW fan, but still Melbourne feels more classy. Melbourne's got less people so it gives you the better feeling. It's also new compared to Sydney but in the pictures melbourne just can't do it.

I decided to say that melbourne might be better but still sydney the biggest city in AUSTRALIA!
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Ahhhhhh.....there is a reason why independent organisations choose Melbourne over Sydney EVERYTIME.... I MEAN REALLY....EVERYTIME. In fact best in the world. Most livable city anyway. So to those Sydney siders who like to keep score......Melbourne EVERY time so far , Sydney NIL.......
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chooc
chooc Melbourne is not the most liveable city in the world. According to Mercer for the last 5 years, Sydney is the most liveable (quality of living ) in Australia and the only Australian city ranked top 10th in the world, not Melbourne. Sydney also voted by Sydney Is also ranked 10th best city in the world as it is the only Australian. Sadly, it was never mentioned in The Age or by any news in Melbourne. I wonder how many Melbournians know about it.
2yrs+
jimb14
jimb14 You're mistaken. The Economist's Global Liveability Report 2017 ranks the world's most livable cities thusly:

1. Melbourne, Australia
2. Vienna, Austria
3. Vancouver, Canada
4. Toronto, Canada
5. Calgary, Canada
6. Adelaide, Australia
7. Perth, Australia
8. Auckland, New Zealand
9. Helsinki, Finland
10. Hamburg, Germany

Nowhere on that list is Sydney.
2yrs+
TimT
TimT Sydney dropped off the list due to fears of terrorism. Legit or not. The Economist is a UK publication, so...London?
Three Canadian cities are on this list. Snooze. That says it all right there. Melbourne is in very boring company on that list.
2yrs+
jimb14
jimb14 Melbourne and it's surrounds has more going on than Sydney.
The Economist being based in London is irrelevent.
2yrs+
chooc
chooc Here are the lists for Sydney Vs Melbourne:
Mercer World Quality of Living (New York based) 2018 City Ranking: Sydney 10th Vs Melbourne 16th.
Economic Intelligence Unit World Liveable City ( London based) 2017 Ranking: Sydney 11th Vs Melbourne 1st. I suspect Melbourne will not retain its position this coming August as she suffers from too many skyscrapers (sun light & shadows), traffic, crime rate & higher unemployment than Sydney. And bigger population increase than Sydney. Sydney"s transportation is the second best after Brisbane (Google it).
PWC World Best City (Price Waterhouse Cooper London based) 2017 Ranking: Sydney 5th Vs Melbourne outside 30th.
In summary, Sydney is the Australia Global City, most reputable city in the world by The Reputation Institute 2017 Ranking (Boston based) and the most liveable city in Australia based on above measurement.
Sydney has the most investment in transportation in Australia. It has the biggest Metro investment in Australia, 2nd International Airport in Western Sydney, WestConnect, NorthConnect & 2 light rails.
For the last decade, due to City of Sydney Council high standard requirement for buildings development, it has produced very high quality buildings in CBD Sydney. Result of this, Sydney has won many International Architecture Awards (Example:: Sydney Central, EY Building at 200 George St, Barangaroo Park, etc).
To solve pupolation surge in the future, State Government is planning for for a decentralised Sydney into 3 cities (City of East Harbour, City of River Parramatta & City of Parklands Webster Sydney).
Sydney is the Financial Capital , fintech and tourism of Australia, Sydney is also the educational hub & culture hub (film industry/ Adelaide is the real culture City of Australia).
2yrs+
bitht
bitht TimT have you even been to any of those Canadian cities listed? You fool. Theyre much better than Sydney .. ALL THREE of them!
Sep 09, 2019
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Andresff 2yrs+
I'm not a fan of hot weather, so I'd choose Melbourne which is in average cooler than Sydney.
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ConnarOO 2yrs+
High-Class Shopping: Both Cities
Sport: Melbourne: Football, Sydney: Rugby League.
Airports: Melbourne
Theme Parks, Zoos, Wildlife Parks, Aquariums, Museums etc.: Sydney
High-Class Accommodation (E.G. Rydges, Sheraton): Sydney
Beaches: Sydney (E.G. Bondi, Cronulla, Manly)
Public Transport: Melbourne
Hospitality: Both Cities

I do like both Cities. But Melbourne is my first choice because AFL is my favourite Sport followed by Cricket, then Basketball, then NRL & then MotoGP. I also like Sydney because the fact that some Retail Outlets trade 24 Hours.
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